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Depending on who you talk to or what you read, you might think you missed the boat on learning how to use AI. But Nick Machol disagrees. Machol is a Daniels College of Business alumnus, chair of the Executive Advisory Board and the boss at Denver-based AI enablement studio Unburdn. His team helps companies implement AI into their businesses, helping them find efficiencies by making the technology understandable and accessible. On this episode, he shares his must-have tools, whether the future of AI is boom or doom and how humans fit into that equation.
Show Notes
Nick Machol is the co-founder and CEO of Denver-based Unburdn, a company that helps others learn how to implement AI at their business. Machol is a 2008 graduate from the University of Denver’s Daniels College of Business, with a dual degree in accounting.
Table of Contents
2:52 Boom, doom, or somewhere in between?
4:20 The AI tools Machol uses every day
6:09 Don’t get married to your tools
7:23 Inside the Devil’s Advocate GPT
9:40 Crawling, walking and running with AI
14:45 Truth, trust and the AI content dilemma
16:23 Why human speed is strategy
18:32 The MAFO mindset: Mess Around and Find Out
22:30 Advice and show notes
Bonus Question:
In this episode:
- About Unburdn
- Unburdn: Crawl, Walk, Run
- Futurism: What Tech Insiders Actually Think of AI Is Extremely Revealing
Related articles and information:
- Microsoft: Human-centered AI — Copilot Fall Release
- Reuters: India proposes strict IT rules labeling deepfakes amid AI misuse
- Fortune: Experts say the high failure rate in AI adoption isn’t a bug — it’s a feature
- New York Post: Business Insider to publish AI-created stories under “Business Insider AI” byline
Transcript
Nick Greenhalgh:
Depending on who you talk to or what you read, you might think you missed the boat on learning how to use AI, but Nick Machol disagrees.
Nick Machol:
Don’t assume that anyone is good at this. Don’t assume that that ship has set sail and you’re too late to the party.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Machol is a Daniels College of Business alumnus, chair of the Executive Advisory Board, and the boss at Denver-based AI enablement studio Unburdn. His team helps companies implement AI into their businesses, helping them find efficiencies by making the technology both understandable and accessible. On this episode, he shares his must-have tools, whether the future of AI is boom or doom, and how humans fit into that equation—or should I say, algorithm.
Nick, welcome to the show.
Nick Machol:
Thanks for having me, fellow Nick.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Nick, let’s hop in. We’re approaching the third anniversary of ChatGPT’s public launch. That feels like a landmark moment in the space. Are you surprised by how integrated AI is into our daily business and personal lives? Did you expect perhaps a slower adoption?
Nick Machol:
Yeah, absolutely blown away. I don’t think we’ve ever seen anything like this—consumer technology hit the scene, named poorly, might I add. I don’t think most people know what GPT even stands for—generative pre-trained transformer, if you’re wondering—which doesn’t matter, and it still makes no sense.
Even I remember hearing about it, someone who I’d consider to be an early adopter of tech, going “What is this ChatGPT?” and disregarding it for months. Not accessing it, not trying it, not telling my friends who I really respect, “You’ve got to check this thing out.” Even then, getting online with it, I didn’t really understand what the heck you do with it—other than have it write funny poems or songs in the voice of Snoop Dogg for your kids.
It’s like, “What is the application here?” It’s amazing that now, three years later, it’s on everybody’s mind. It’s the topic of conversation in every boardroom, every C-suite, every investor meeting.
From sophisticated to unsophisticated, people have realized that it’s a real technology and incredibly disruptive. I can’t believe we’re living through it. I can’t believe I get to lean in and be part of this. It’s mind-blowing—and it’s been a fast three years. I can’t even believe it’s only been three years because it feels like thirty.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Good segue. Let’s fast-forward three years. Where are we now? What does the technology look like?
Nick Machol:
I’ve been saying recently, we’re either in a world where many of the big players, such as ChatGPT, have already gone bankrupt—or they’ve taken over our government and enslaved us all—or somewhere in between. It’s a good noncommittal answer.
All I know is advancement is continuing. The power of AI is doubling about every seven months. Every time you think it’s going to plateau, it doesn’t. There’s still so much more to happen.
There’s a nuclear arms race of compute, data centers, and energy investments. The more of those that come online, the more these models can be trained, the more the economy centers around it. People like me drop everything to start businesses and innovate.
More wild stuff is going to happen. You just need to look at the next three years through the lens of your philosophies and ethics. There are arguments for boom, arguments for doom—it could land anywhere in between. Personally, I lean a little more toward boom than doom, but that’s subject to change based on tomorrow’s headlines.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Let’s go from macro to micro a little bit. What AI tools do you use every day?
Nick Machol:
Right now, I have to use a ton of them. That’s one tough thing about my job—trying to be someone who educates and trains in this space means I can’t just get comfortable and sit back.
I use ChatGPT primarily as my day-to-day tool as a knowledge worker. The user interface is intuitive, and the horsepower of the models is generally good for what I do.
Because I do a lot of education and presenting, I love Gamma right now. I use it for presentations—it’s amazing. I think back on my career and how much time I spent putting together PowerPoints and how miserable it was. Now, I can put a cool prompt into Gamma, and it rips out something that’s 80 to 85 percent of the way there. Then I just spend a few hours making it beautiful.
I’ve also been using Google’s Notebook a ton. I use it to pull in information—whether it’s from a podcast like this or articles I’m reading. I use it to make study guides or summaries. That’s where I’m spending my time right now, among 10,000 other tools I’m playing with.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Are you always looking for new tools, or are you satisfied with what you have?
Nick Machol:
One of the “Laws of AI Excellence” my team created is: You can’t get married to any of these tools right now. The days of saying “I’m a Mac person” or “I’m a PC person” are gone.
Anyone who wants to succeed as a knowledge worker and be tech-forward has to stay adaptable. You’ve got to get good at something, but you also need to look up and test new stuff.
I thought for a while I was going all in on Claude, but there were quirks. Same with Gemini. I still use them, but I keep coming back to ChatGPT.
And here’s the surprise—I’ve been using Microsoft Copilot a little lately. I thought it was a throwaway, but it’s getting better. I’m not saying drop everything for it, but it’s one of those tools I’m keeping an eye on.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Can you tell our listeners a little about the “Devil’s Advocate GPT” you’ve built?
Nick Machol:
Sure. Generative AI tools like ChatGPT are hardwired to be sycophants—they’ll rarely tell you “I don’t know,” and they’ll often confirm your biases. They’re confidently incorrect sometimes.
So when you can create a GPT that pushes back—a devil’s advocate—you take it down a few notches. I like using it to poke holes in my ideas. It’s still a little too nice, no matter how much I try to make it mean, but that’s okay.
I love programming it to beat up my ideas. It’s valuable. One reason I’ve been successful is because I’ve been surrounded by people smarter and more ambitious than me—people who challenge me. That used to be hard to find. Now, AI democratizes that access. You can have thought partners in your pocket, and most people don’t realize that.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Your company uses a “crawl, walk, run” framework for understanding and deploying AI. Can you explain what that means?
Nick Machol:
There are no silver bullets in AI, and everyone wants one. Some companies are blowing the doors off trying to “do AI,” but they spend a fortune and end up with nothing sustainable.
What I’ve learned firsthand—and what MIT and other researchers are showing—is that you have to do it slowly. Start by understanding what these models are and how simple they actually are. It’s just software that predicts the next word. Once you get that, you can start using it effectively.
You build up from crawl to walk to run. I spend 99 percent of my time in crawl mode—using AI as a knowledge worker to amplify my work, improve accuracy, and spark creativity. Once you build a shared culture around AI in your business, then you can scale to workflow automation and bigger wins.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Most companies you work with—are they still in the crawl phase?
Nick Machol:
Yes, and that’s exactly where they should be. They’re learning what AI can do. Some are ready to hire people or build automations, but most are focusing on learning the skill.
A lot of leaders are realizing that getting good at AI is like learning a new language—it’s not instant efficiency. It’s about building capability and freeing up bandwidth long-term.
Nick Greenhalgh:
We’ve seen AI-generated content improving rapidly. But that also means people are being duped online. How do we manage truth on the internet going forward?
Nick Machol:
Everything you said is true—and it’s getting worse. Have you tried Sora 2 yet? It’s mind-blowing. But people need to be cautious—using these tools gives away a lot of personal information.
We’re living in an age where content creation will become fully digital. We’ll overcorrect, over-automate, and then realize—wait, humans are actually pretty special.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Speaking of humans—how can business leaders stand out in this AI world?
Nick Machol:
Don’t assume anyone is good at this yet. If you start now, you’re not too late.
Once you take action, remember—speed is strategy. You can prototype an idea for $20 a month that used to take a year and a team. That’s huge.
Startups can move faster because they’re not weighed down by old systems. Legacy companies can’t pivot as quickly—they have operational debt. That’s where leaders can differentiate: through agility and speed.
Nick Greenhalgh:
You’ve said you embrace a “mess around and find out” mindset. Tell us about that.
Nick Machol:
MAFO—Mess Around and Find Out. And the “find out” part isn’t negative. It’s about curiosity and persistence.
AI can feel frictionless, but the friction is in the results. If you give up when the output isn’t great, you’ll never improve. Stick with it, keep experimenting, and the payoff compounds.
Nick Greenhalgh:
As a leader, what qualities do you look for when hiring?
Nick Machol:
I hire for values—drive, curiosity, perseverance. We talk about “speed is strategy” and “get-after-it-ness.”
I also hire people smarter than me. If I’m the smartest person in the room, I’m in the wrong room.
Early in my career, I hired mirror images of myself—it was exhausting. Now, I hire people with complementary skills. That’s when work becomes fun and culture thrives.
Nick Greenhalgh:
To wrap up, as a Voice of Experience, what’s one piece of advice you’d share with listeners?
Nick Machol:
Enjoy the ride. Building Unburdn is exciting and meaningful, but I’ve learned not to chase only the end result. Focus on the work, the people, and the purpose.
Make sure you’re getting out of bed for the right reasons—whether it’s family, community, impact, or challenge. Don’t just live for what life might look like five years from now if you grind hard enough.
Nick Greenhalgh:
Thanks, Nick.
Nick Machol:
Awesome. Thank you. This was a pleasure.
Nick Greenhalgh:
If you want more from Nick on the AI tools he recommends using every day, check out our show notes for a bonus question. You can find that and more at daniels.du.edu/voe-podcast.
The VOE Podcast is an extension of Voices of Experience, the signature speaker series at the Daniels College of Business, sponsored by U.S. Bank. Katia G is our sound engineer. Joshua Muetzel wrote our theme. I’m Nick Greenhalgh, and we’ll talk again soon.